By Hillsdale College December 7, 2018
HUGH HEWITT: Good morning glory, America. Bonjour, hi, Canada. Hugh Hewitt, thank you for listening. I'm in the Relieffactor.com studio inside of the Beltway. And at the Kirby Center, Hillsdale College's Lighthouse of Reason. It's one Dr. Larry Arnn, president of Hillsdale College.
Hillsdale.edu is where you find everything related to Hillsdale, including applications to get into this extraordinary institution in the far wilds of Michigan. The lantern of the north I like to call it. All of the online courses that Hillsdale makes available for free. And there are many of them on the Constitution on the founding of the Progressive Era on Shakespeare. They're all available at Hillsdale.edu.
You can also sign up for Imprimis there. And you can listen to every Hillsdale conversation that we have head back to 2013, the dialogues extend back that far at hughforhillsdale.com One that you won't hear there that we had last night was actually a telephone town hall from the Kirby Center. Dr. Arnn and I sat down to talk about the Barney Charter School Initiative. And before we begin to talk about the funeral of the week and of the past that was quite a good show, Larry Arnn. I'm glad that people who listened learned about the Barney Charter School Initiative. But why don't we tell their regular audience what Hillsdale is doing there as well?
LARRY P. ARNN: We had a bunch of great callers. And I'll tell our audience in a rare compliment, Hugh was in good form last night. We see Barney as a trustee of college. He and one other fellow talked me into trying to do something about public K-12 education. And so what we decided to do was, you need to have a whole school. You need to have a good school. And we know little about that. So, we sent out an RFP, a Request for Proposals. And we said, if you want to start a charter school in your area, we'll help you. We'll help steer you through the charter process and we'll help you train your teachers. And we'll provide your curriculum.
And we'll help you hire a headmaster. And we'll visit you every year, twice a year most schools. We'll help you run the school great. And so, your teachers can come to Hillsdale in the summer. About 500 teachers do come every summer. The number is growing, because there are 20 of those charter schools now in there.
HEWITT: And the roads are open too in the summertime, the roads are open.
ARNN: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Stop whining about the weather. But, yeah. So, it's a big deal. And it's fun. And the schools don't pay us anything. These are public charter schools. And they have a charter or contract with the government that lets them behave in a less regulated way. So, all the students learn Latin. And all the students learn to read very early. We have never actually graduated a kindergartner who couldn't read. And so, it's a big movement. And it's a big thing. And it's a big thing for the college. I didn't quite understand what a scale, it would grow to. But it's still growing.
HEWITT: Still growing. 20 schools in nine states. And if you would like to download the town hall that we had last night, which was really quite remarkable-- Phil Kilgore who is the director of the Barney Charter School Initiative was joining us. And we had calls from all over the country and Facebook online. It's at Hillsdale.edu/townhall. And if you want you can call 800-437-2268. 800-437-2268 for more information or indeed to make a donation to the Barney Charter School Initiative. Steve Barney must be an amazing guy to care so passionately about resurrecting K-12 education in America.
ARNN: I described it last night-- described him. He's a blubber baby. He's a big, tall man, good looking, investment business. And he's a very sympathetic person. So, he got to poking me in the chest with his finger and saying, you have to do something about this. These children are growing up without knowing anything. And he cried while he said it. So, what was I going to do?
HEWITT: That you had to do what you had to do. Speaking of blubbering, James Baker, former Secretary of State, former Secretary of the Treasury, chief of staff to Ronald Reagan, best friend of George H.W. Bush, closed his remarks with tears yesterday as did the president's son, George W. Bush, the president on Thursday-- on Wednesday.
There are a lot of tears in the passing of a great man. What did you make of this week's ceremonies, Dr. Arnn?
ARNN: Well, I first of all, forgetting about the effects of it on the nation or what it demonstrated to the nation, It was just a lovely thing. Because this was a family and friends of good character who loved each other for a long time. James Baker says he was George H.W. Bush's friend for 60 years. And they lived their lives together. And they lived them with rectitude. And so that makes for a great funeral, whether a state funeral or a private funeral.
And it had the elements of celebration that are right for a funeral. And they had the deep sadness that's right for a funeral.
HEWITT: And they had the setting, which is right for a funeral, one which is in a church-- a magnificent cathedral in fact-- and they spoke of the immortal soul of George H.W. Bush, which you don't hear much of anymore. The Christian faith of the late president and of his son much on display, much in evidence, and increasingly rare in our secularized society.
ARNN: Isn't it something? Yeah. And we don't think enough about the things that matter-- what will you think about as you approach your death? And the ancient wisdom is you should live your life in anticipation of that moment. So that you can look back and think that you did things that were worthy. And then you can go and meet your maker. And that's how the Bushes tried to live their lives.
HEWITT: The concept of conscience is unfortunately fading from our--and judgment. The old Catholic church-- the old Catholic church said every day think upon four things-- Heaven and Hell, death and judgment. And that had a wonderful way of concentrating the mind. Heaven and Hell, death and judgment. And so that would tend to put you on the North Star.
But when I saw you last night, I said to you, I wanted to talk about the farewells of Lincoln and Churchill. Because I was put in mind of them this week. And Lincoln's was particularly traumatic, as was JFK's. But everyone had died in that-- 660,000 people were dead. And the country was pretty much ripped up, though put back together again. And victory had been achieved. What do you credit the Lincoln proceedings with doing or having done to the country?
ARNN: Well, so in all three of these funerals-- Lincoln, Churchill, and George H.W. Bush-- trains are involved.
ARNN: In all of them, tracks are lined with people to see. Lincoln, a long train ride back to Illinois. And what made it, it's a combination-- in the cases of Lincoln and Churchill, these are spectacular people. These are people who have a gift beyond normal.
And George H.W. Bush may be considered to have that gift eventually. Although there was talk in his funeral that he was not an eloquent man. And those two were. And then you take that and put that together with the fact that the country went through a terrible trauma. And they went through it—it went through it under his direction.
So, there's a woman, I was reading-- I was watching some video clips of interviews during Churchill's funeral. In Churchill's funeral, 350,000 people-- 320,000 people maybe-- filed through his lying in state in Westminster Hall.
ARNN: And it went on for days. And it was bitter cold. And they had to queue outside. And they started way early. And they expected that they would get it done in a day. And it took a day and a night and a day and a night. And finally-- and they waited. And the last one filed through at 8:00 in the morning. And things started at 8:45.
ARNN: It was just very remarkable. And this woman is interviewed. And she said she met him twice. Once she saw him. And once she shook his hand. And she talked about-- she said two main things. She said we all knew that nothing bad could happen to us while Winston was alive. So there's a great personal loss that goes with this.
And then she said he was an agent of things from way beyond. So it's just very remarkable. Well, Lincoln liked that too. And that's because of the price that everybody paid. And they got through it. And they connect that with this man.
HEWITT: And an add-on to that, the liberator in both cases. The emancipator of the slaves in the case of Abraham Lincoln, father Abraham. And in the case of Winston Churchill, there's that green slab in Westminster Abbey. He's not buried there. He's buried far out in the country. There's a green slab that says, "Remember Winston Churchill" simply because he saved the West.
ARNN: That's right, he did. And Churchill's funeral was like Bush's funeral in a way too. Opponents spoke beautifully about him. So Clement Attlee-- the socialist who beat him in the 1945 election, but who was his Deputy Prime Minister during the war, there was a war hero-- said, "He's an agent of civilization. We will never see his like again."
HEWITT: Wow. I'll be right back with Dr. Larry Arnn of Hillsdale College. I wonder what lieutenant JG-- Lieutenant JG George H.W. Bush thought of Winston Churchill, under whose direction, at least partially, he flew his 58 missions. We'll find out. We'll talk with Larry Arnn, when we return to The Hugh Hewitt Show.
Welcome back, America I am Hugh Hewitt. Thank you for listening to The Hugh Hewitt Show. Talking with Dr. Larry Arnn, President of Hillsdale College in this the Hillsdale Dialogue. We close the last radio hour of the week always on big subjects, important subjects with Dr. Arnn or one of his colleagues.
This week, of course, Herbert Walker Bush-- George Herbert Walker Bush laid to rest. His career as a public servant began as lieutenant JG flying off the San Jacinto 58 times, getting back 56 times, twice splashing down in the South Pacific. And, although FDR was his Commander in Chief and the chain of command is murky in my mind, in some ways, he's fighting for Churchill as well, is he not, Larry Arnn?
ARNN: Yeah. Well, I looked up since you said we were going to talk about that. They were cousins-- Churchill and George.
HEWITT: Oh, really?
ARNN: Yeah, yeah. There's a man named William Sumner. And he lived a long time ago. And he gave rise to a line of people in whom this Leonard Walter Jerome, the father of Churchill's mother. And then Churchill comes next. And then through a daughter, Hannah, eight generations down, he gave rise to Prescott Sheldon Bush.
ARNN: And so, they're eighth cousins once removed. Once removed means George H.W. Bush came a generation later than Churchill.
HEWITT: That is remarkable. I have to tell you that is very good to know. I was invited twice to the Oval Office when W. was president. The first time was on August 7th, 2007 with a couple of radio hosts. And he had Lincoln over the door. And he said-- and I remember quite distinctly-- "41 is in my heart, but 16," he said, pointing to Lincoln, "is in my head. I am a wartime president. And I have to conduct it--" this was during the surge and he was looking for support. He needed people to rally to him. And, of course, wartime president-- they were both. Both Bushes were wartime presidents. And Churchill and Lincoln are wartime leaders. And to a certain extent, if you're not a wartime president, you're not really going to reach the top of the game.
ARNN: Well, it's a sad thing to say, isn't it?
HEWITT: But it's a true thing. Yeah.
ARNN: It is. Calvin Coolidge was a very great president, in my opinion. But he wasn't involved in a struggle for the survival of the nation. And the ones who do that, that's the worst thing. Both George W. Bush and Winston Churchill and Abraham Lincoln-- that was a terrible trial for them. They were all people who could stand up to it. Churchill, in fact, thrived under it, except when sometimes it would just be terrible.
But he was good at being at war. And he, unlike the others, he knew a lot of war. He was in the service. He was in four wars. And so--
HEWITT: He was in a cavalry charge.
ARNN: He was. That's right. In 1898 in the Sudan against a radical Islamic army, one of the first ones. Yeah so he's--
HEWITT: It's kind of remarkable when you consider Churchill's life merged with H.W.'s. And they overlap as Commander in Chief of Great Britain and a lieutenant JG in the Pacific. And George Herbert Walker Bush dying this week-- that's quite a span for two lifetimes.
ARNN: Isn't it, though? Yeah. And it teaches you that-- I'm not very good at family genealogy-- but I looked this up. And it's remarkable. Because up three generations on that line back to William Sumner, I know something about all of those people, both on Bush's side and Churchill's side. And that means that somebody's great, great, great, great grandfather knew somebody that you and I know about because they're ancestors of a great man.
HEWITT: And the other interesting thing-- the historian Jon Meacham said about George Herbert Walker Bush that more than any recent president he shared in the character of the Framers in reference to Washington specifically. I think he was referring to rectitudeness. What do you make of that assertion by Meacham?
ARNN: Yeah. They were people-- George H.W. Bush was an interesting man. Assertive people are often not like him. And what I mean is one of the things that George H.W. Bush would do when he was in school-- he had a nickname because of it-- is that if he was eating something and somebody came up, he would say, "Have half."
HEWITT: And that was his nickname.
ARNN: And people called him that. I went to the White House. I was on a commission appointed by George H.W. Bush on housing. And I went to the White House to debrief him. And he asked a naive question. He said, "How can people put these regulations on things that cost people their houses?" I said, "Mr. President, they like to tell people what to do."
HEWITT: What to do. We'll be right back. And sometimes I wonder about how patricians don't really understand the world working and its grimiest local government details. Dr. Larry Arnn's my guest. It is the Hillsdale Dialogue. Stay tuned.
Welcome back, America. It's Hugh Hewitt in the relieffactor.com studio inside a very cold Beltway, with Dr. Larry Arnn, president of Hillsdale College. All things Hillsdale are collected at Hillsdale.edu. And all of their online courses, which you can enjoy and enrich your life, is over at Hillsdale.edu.
You can sign up for the free speech digest Imprimis which goes to two million people a month. And you can listen to every one of our conversation dating back to 2013 with Dr. Arnn or colleagues of his about subjects large and mostly large, sometimes occasionally small at hughforhillsdale.com. I have to make sure I get something correct, Dr. Arnn. The first lady of Hillsdale was at the Kirby Center last night, Penny Arnn. And I extended to her an invitation to dine with the fetching Mrs. Hewitt. Now, I just wanted to make sure you knew you were not included in that. We just wanted her to come.
ARNN: Well, that's why she's so keen to accept.
HEWITT: Yeah. Just wanted to make sure that, if you overheard that, we were talking to her, not you. Tell us a little bit about the bitterness in the country. I wrote about it in the Washington Post today. But you did a study of some of the coverage of the H.W. Bush funeral. And it was revealing.
ARNN: Yeah. It's worth thinking about for a minute. Because I read-- what led me to it was I read-- I read The Wall Street Journal and the New York Times. And I read The Wall Street Journal more. But I read them both. And then Hugh sends me his articles in the Washington Post, which I don't read.
But Hugh's was very beautiful about the fact that we've become cruel to each other. And the Bushes were not part of that. And The Wall Street Journal's article is really lovely because it talks about the peace that reigned in the country for three days and how welcome that was. And they didn't make a negative comment about anybody. They just said that has to do with the Bushes and their character.
It's very pretty. And I'm hoping one of my students who works there wrote it. But somebody great wrote it. And then I read the New York Times this morning to get the timetable of the Bush funeral in my mind. And they're pretty good. They're a thorough paper. But in that article there are eight paragraphs making negative comments about Donald Trump. And they make the point that there was an awkward greeting between Trump and the Obamas. And he and the Clintons ignored each other.
What the Chicago Tribune says-- watching the same thing with their own eyes-- not a conservative bastion that-- and what they said was, they gave brief, courteous greetings-- the presidents-- to one another. And so everything is read into the thing to make it-- and they only make the point that the Bushes were great to make the point that their successors are not. And so that's too bad. And I want to shut up about that now. Except to just say that that is one of the great things about the Bushes. They were high-minded people.
HEWITT: And the family that gathered-- not just President George W. Bush and Governor Jeb Bush, but Marvin and Doro and Neil and their children, and they're legion of grandchildren and great grandchildren, and the pictures of Walker point-- make a point about family, God, and country at the same time that they're being made.
I want to look at the second row. I was talking to Matt Spalding, director of the Kirby Center yesterday about how magnificent it is for the world to see. They don't read The New York Times commentary that blames Trump for everything. They simply see a row of presidents that haven't killed each other upon taking office, which is not an unusual circumstance in some parts of the world.
You don't have eight ex-presidents because they vanish. They go away or they die in office. They just don't retire. Jimmy Carter's been retired since 1980. It's remarkable. Two comments. They're all boomers except for Jimmy Carter. And I'm tired of boomers as president. And the vice presidents are a remarkable lot. And George H.W. Bush was a remarkable vice president.
ARNN: Yeah. Well, I heard Ed Meese-- the very great Ed Meese-- give a talk this week. And what he talked about-- Ed Meese is also a man of tremendous character and without bile. And he was getting an award. And so he talked about somebody else, which is what he always does. And our friend Mark Levin got an award. He did the same thing.
Meese said that I just want to remember that the best president, vice president I know of is George H.W. Bush, who was loyal and effective and straight and honest and never betrayed the president. And he wanted to be president. And he did become president. And he had run against Ronald Reagan and said hard things about Reagan when he was running in the way you do in politics. And I admired the speech of James Baker very much at the Bush funeral. I thought it was very fine. They all were very fine. But his was particularly so, I thought.
And I thought back to those days when Meese and Baker and Deaver, you reminded me, were competing for influence everybody thought-- I thought-- everybody who knew about it thought-- with Reagan. But the larger truth was Baker was a loyal friend of George H.W. Bush. And Reagan respected that because H.W. Bush had been a friend to him.
HEWITT: It was a remarkable partnership that endured for many years. George H.W. Bush reaching out to James Baker to run his congressional campaign, because James baker's first wife had died. And they became lifelong tennis buddies, partners, et cetera. But people forget when there was a merger of the wings of the Republican Party-- the Reagan wing and the Bush wing-- and I was a Bushie in '78, '79. I was working for Nixon. But I was a Bushie. Nixon won and Connally. And you were probably a Reaganite. But most of the people who had been with Ford in '76 became Bushies in '78 as that campaign got underway. Because Ford and Bush represented a different Republican Party than Ronald Reagan represented-- the ascendancy of the West-- what the Paul Laxalt. And Ronald Reagan wanted Paul Laxalt to be his vice president. Was told he couldn't have him because he was a Nevadan, couldn't do it.
And so he then talked with Gerald Ford about being co-president. That would've been a terrible idea. And then he did the obvious and smart thing which vice president-- the presidential nominees ought always to do, which is pick whoever came in second. Why, Larry-- I was wanting to ask you, since you're a Lincoln scholar-- Hannibal Hamlin was Abraham Lincoln's first vice president, United States senator. He was replaced by Andrew Johnson, who was not a very good vice president and a terrible president by most accounts. You might have a different view of that. Why did Lincoln dump Hamlin?
ARNN: Well, Johnson was a Southerner. And it revealed later how far those sympathies ran. As president and vice president, Andrew Johnson stunk up the joint and was often drunk while he did it.
So the thing is politics is about inclusion not exclusion. And the one who includes the most wins. And you have to exclude some in order to include others. But you start with the idea how do you build a thing that'll work?
And Lincoln was looking forward to patching up the country. And so he thought Johnson might help with that. It's like in 1940, David Lloyd George, who was an old-- the prime minister in the First World War in Britain-- who was an old friend and enemy of Churchill's and who had been overly sympathetic to Hitler and Churchill had fought with him about that.
Churchill talked to him about coming into the government in the hope that if Britain was conquered, Hitler would pick him and not Oswald Mosley to run the country. And that would be better. So he was keeping an anchor to the wind.
HEWITT: Interesting. I didn't know that. I've never heard that until this morning.
ARNN: Yeah, yeah. It's very dramatic. And Churchill, by the way, he was like James Baker manifested himself to be at the funeral. Churchill was loyal. Churchill didn't forget old friendships. He very much had the view and often said it, but he acted this way too, that the bitterness of politics should not interrupt personal relations.
And so he was calculating. And he always respected and admired Lloyd George. And there are places where Lloyd George just took him apart-- Churchill. And then there are also places where Lloyd George-- Lloyd George and Churchill worked together to build a social safety net that prevailed in Britain until the socialists made it worse in 1945. And it was a very good thing before it was ruined.
And you're going to have one of those. And you need to set it up right so it doesn't reward not working.
ARNN: They did that together. And then in the First World War, Churchill was disgraced unjustly in my opinion, and left the government, went and fought in the trenches. And Lloyd George brought him back against very heavy conservative opposition, made him Minister of Munitions, and then Secretary of State for the colonies. And so he revived Churchill's career. And Churchill never forgot that.
HEWITT: Well, Sulla, the dictator of Rome, had over his tomb, "No friend has done me a favor, nor enemy an injury that I have not repaid in full." I think H.W. bought into the former. I'm not sure he was one for score settling. But I also like to be historically accurate. When H.W. took over for Ronald Reagan, there were a lot of heads that rolled as--
ARNN: Oh, yeah.
HEWITT: --as team Bush came into town. And they wanted to make very clear they were in charge not President Reagan from California. And they did make that very, very clear rather brusquely.
ARNN: There was a purge. And, see, you have to remember something else. Reagan was like Trump in this regard. And that is he just came from nowhere. He came from-- as you pointed out-- he came from another continent, the west coast.
And so the Bushes, however, east coast Texas people who've been involved in politics for three generations now. George H.W. Bush's father, Prescott Bush, was a senator from Connecticut. And they moved down to Texas. And they kept their involvement. And that meant that they had people, lots of them. And Dan Quayle, whom I know well and admire very much-- and oddly enough, he has a reputation for not being too smart. He's just as sharp as a tack--
HEWITT: Yes, he is.
ARNN: --and quick too. He explained a lot of the workings of things in the Bush administration to me, because he was an excellent vice president too. And he sat in. He said that the presidency is this, Larry. He said it's eight or 10 hours a day of grueling meetings where the worst things in the world are brought into you.
ARNN: And an enormous-- he said there have been enormous forces maneuvering to influence what gets in there. And then you sit there and do it. And you can't have very many people around because then there'll be leaks. And so he says, that's what makes you old. And he said that George Bush was awesome. George H.W. Bush was awesome in those meetings. And he did his work. And he said it's what makes you old when you're the president.
HEWITT: When we come back, we'll talk one more segment with Dr. Larry Arnn in the Hillsdale Dialogue about the week that was.
Welcome back, America. I'm not sure if Duane was able to find Ike commenting on the BBC in time. But it did put me in mind-- with Dr. Larry Arnn, president of Hillsdale College and all things Hillsdale at Hillsdale.edu-- of the 1910 accounts of the funeral of Edward VII.
He, of course, was marched into eternity by his son George the V. But there were nine sovereigns. And there were about 30 dukes and grand dukes and czars on horseback when they laid him to rest. It made me think, Dr. Arnn, that we do our big funerals. And we've got a lot of more of them coming. Oh-- well, let me finish this thought. When Queen Elizabeth goes, that's going to be a funeral.
ARNN: That's right. She's going to be the longest reigning monarch. And she's the one who placed those words in Westminster Abbey you quoted. "Remember Winston Churchill." And what a great woman she is.
HEWITT: She's been queen since before I was born. It's the most remarkable run. And getting more beloved by the day.
ARNN: Yeah. She's outdone Queen Victoria. Isn't that something?
HEWITT: It is. Now, Duane, what do you have there of Ike talking about Churchill.
DUANE PATTERSON: I found the actual state funeral of Winston Churchill. I don't know if it's from the BBC. I think it probably has to be. But there is a passage when they start talking about the Americans. And it sounds like it could be Dwight Eisenhower's voice. But it's the best I could do on short notice. You want to hear some of it?
HEWITT: Yes, yes.
SPEAKER: Over the past week, it has been said many times that Sir Winston Churchill was the greatest Englishman of this age. Of course, he was. And no American would wish to deny or detract from the possessive pride of Englishmen and the greatness of this man. The Americans have still more reasons to feel also possessive about him. His meaning to us is different, of course, than is his meaning to you. In some ways, he was almost more important to us.
We take it for granted now that Americans will feel this way. Yet in truth, it is remarkable. Sir Winston is the first foreigner Americans could so respect and trust. The first foreigner who to us did not seem a foreigner, but even one of us. The first foreigner we have allowed to help make our national policies, whom we did accept as a leader of us.
Older Americans can remember when such closeness could not have happened, been felt, or expressed. It is different now. The old distrust belongs to times gone by, to times before Winston Churchill. During the war and the after-war period, the image of Britain in American eyes was transformed. Before the days of Winston Churchill, many an American saw Britain as a selfish, imperial taskmaster, not always considerate of others. During the Churchill era, that image has been transformed.
Today, the word "Britain" brings up memories of the great Churchill speeches, the bravery and pride of standing alone, the pledge to fight even in the streets. Thanks more to Winston Churchill than to any one other man, we Americans who once thought of Britain as rapacious, insolent, and domineering now think of Britain as sturdy, brave, and above all, honorable.
Americans here with you today are privileged. We will tell our grandchildren of how we saw with our own eyes and watched as they carried the great Winston Churchill up the Thames to take him to Blatant Village there to lay him beside his American mother. Sir Winston, you belong to us just as much as you belong to your own British people. We're proud of our share in you. We too salute you.
HEWITT: Now, I don't think that's Ike, Larry Arnn, do you? It was wonderful. But I don't think it's Ike. Did we lose Larry? Did Larry put us on pause?
ARNN: Sorry. Hello, sorry. I don't think it is Eisenhower either. But it's good. Here's the line from the Daily Telegraph report of the Churchill funeral. "The BBC is televising everything live. General Eisenhower, the former US president, has joined veteran broadcaster Richard Dimbleby--" whose son, by the way, was later a famous British broadcaster-- "in the studio as a commentator."
So what he was doing according to this was being interviewed by Dimbleby and commenting on the things that were happening in the funeral.
HEWITT: OK, so maybe we'll find that for next week. But that might have been Dimbleby. But it was an American, obviously, because of the use of the possessives.
ARNN: There you go.
HEWITT: He was speaking about-- and it was very beautifully said about Churchill. And so we end this week of funerals with remembering another great man. Looking forward to more.
Larry Arnn, thank you as always. Great commentary. There's very few people that can bring it all together like Dr. Arnn can. For all of us, I want to thank you so much, everyone who helped this week put together these amazing events to say goodbye to George H.W. Bush and to provide us with audio. And to Adam and Duane and Ben, thank you, thank you, thank you. It's quite a week of broadcasting with so many different elements and so many different aspects to cover, so much audio.